To better demonstrate this gigantic issue, here's a handy editor-shot of the section in question:


Key:
Arrow Pointing into Map: Entry to this area for the first half of Gez's section
Arrow Pointing out of Map: Where I'm hoping Xaser has continued on from
1) "Disneyland" - the big red rock area with the red castle shown in this post
2) A huge, blank canvas area
3) The bloody caves styled after "Gorefest" from Coils of the Twisted Tale
4) The large open arena, which is a more-complete version of this area
5) The only part that isn't even a remotely complete layout
6) The current home of the yellow skull key switch, which is part of one half of what's needed to open the gate to Xaser's area
X: The current home of the red skull key - part of the other half of said sequence


Right, basically the entirity of Hell (Gez's part included) in my version of the .pk3 needs a lot of work on visuals and gameplay (including the un-highlighted areas). However, the un-highlighted area, plus sections 1, 3 and (sort-of) 4 are layout complete. Even with as much time as I put in over that weekend, the entirety of my submission was basically one big concept draft, so things may need re-doing, adapting, overhauling and expansion as necessary to bring it into line with the excellent work that the rest of the map is so far. To give you an idea of how crude this process was, sections 1, 2 and 4 were originally three circles laid out like a silhouette of Micky Mouse

In general, the whole Hell area wants to have more tortured marines, corpses, hanging bodies and other hellish things going on - I put in a few examples to demonstrate what I mean (every switch should ideally do it's intended function AND kill some marines, IMO). Captain Toenail's various suggestions are definitely along the lines of what I was thinking and what it seemed people were asking for.

More specifically:
1) This area ideally wants a big overhaul, as it's butt-ugly and doesn't really gel with the style of the rest of the map. I do like the concept and would like a castle in a pit to be here still though

2) My hopes for this area were that it'd be a big, dark, cavernous dungeon, filled with marine torture devices. I imagined a mulching machine a bit like my one near the start of MAP05 of the "Ten" Community Project, a switch which dropped a group of marines a great height to a screaming, gibbing death. You'd basically have to activate all of the marine's deaths to access the key switch (which would be moved from 6, obviously) - I'm perfectly happy to let people do whatever they want with that area though, which is why I left it a blank canvas

3) I'm fairly happy with this part, although it needs more detail(tm) and obviously wants some monsters - I'm thinking Grells and Cacodemons in the swimmable part, maybe some fleshspawns as well - anything goes for the other parts. Detail there would want to be fleshy or rocky really, to keep with the current theme. If people thing the "Gorefest" theme is no good, then do change it completely if you really want. I've made it so it's mostly walkable anyway.

4) My one main request here would be to leave my signature/fountain intact (unless it's too obnoxious?) - I quite fancied the area as a big arena, with enemies sniping from the 3D floor cages above and perhaps a couple of particularly big enemies playing centre stage. The gate wants work and the whole area needs some detail too, really. The three teleporters are currently designed to involve gibbing marines to open doors, so they don't open until you've found the respective entry teleport in the main hell area.

5) I literally just ran out of time here, so I dumped the red skull at X and addeda couple of Bruisers to try to convey the need for a challenge. Some sort of challenge or puzzle (preferably involving some tortured or dead marines) would be welcome, along with some real expansion to the area.


Also, my suggestion for the blue skull key might be worth keeping in mind, as there's plenty of spaces to add such a thing in and I feel the soul render should get some time in the lime-light. As we're in hell, souls should probably be the main ammo source for quite a large margin - particularly as I've only introduced the dark claw here (near the yellow skull key, in front of the fountain in the courtyard to the north of the map).

Now, before I'm labelled a prima-donna, these are all just my suggestions and original goals for the areas. It's a community map and you're all talented ZDoom modders, so hell really wants lots of input from everybody to live up to the rest of this map - do make suggestions and throw ideas around too

Hell is no longer massively unfinished. Hence, Phobus no longer sucks.

I think?

Thanks for bringing Hell to near-completion team

I still suck though; that can't be fixed

o/